Gesture and bean
2yr
@vesuvio
After a little break, I have restarted making gesture drawings and when I felt confident enough, I tried to go on drawing the bean for my poses.
I do not keep timing when drawing. Do you think I should try?
Also, I find it really hard to draw the bean on my drawing tablet due to the curve being round. Probably because I cannot see my hand there (it is not a screen tablet).
What could I do to ease up drawing those curves? I mainly draw with wrist and rarely with shoulder, could it be the issue?
2yr
Asked for help
Here are some more drawings. I also did try the robo bean but will make a different thread tomorrow to focus on it.
(The marks on paper are actually darker than they appear, the scanner doesn't grab them tho).
The images I used can be found here: https://imgur.com/a/NaE5SkH.
I haven't really found a way to practice the landmarks so the digital drawing is really as far as I thought about.
@Crystal Blue (she/her) thank you for your reply! It's the video I watched but I feel like I could try and get more from it by rewatching.
Am I getting this right?
Crystal Blue (she/her)
2yr
it does take some time and practice to sink in :) and remember, you don’t have to take advice if it’s not helping. If you are interested in learning more about that type of thinking though, the video series on the force might explain it better: https://youtu.be/IyuCq6VWVeA
for your gesture drawings, remember to stay loose and prioritize big shapes. I can se e you trying to do that, But it looks live you’ve been getting a little lost in the details of the silhouette. I think you could also benefit from doing afew drawings focusing on balance (https://youtu.be/PLBhO-4YEww). A helpful thing to do if you’re not understanding a pose is to go into the pose yourself and see what it feels like.
for the robo bean drawing with reference, it doesn’t match the model, but your perspective is solid and I can see that the not matching was a result of you trying to push the pose. Usually when doing this exercise, the goal is to copy the reference to practice observing perspective. This makes it easier to check your work. However if you like combining the robo bean with pushing poses, go for it!
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2yr
Here is some more work I've done between those two days @Crystal Blue (she/her) @Liandro . I forgot to specify that I am not using any smoothing functionality.
I've tried looking for the Reilly method as Crystal mentioned but I (probably) haven't been able to find the right one as the one I have seen doesn't explain as far as I wished to.
I have tried to figure it out myself tho, while trying my best to make use of what I have seen.
Proko's image limit doesn't allow me to post everything so I've uploaded the models for the gestures on paper on imgur (Link: https://imgur.com/a/PXtSxkG).
I apologize if the paper is thin (using those kinds of sketch books where you draw and then tear the page from the notebook itself to get on the next page while making the drawing unlinked from the rest of the book; It is not possible to go to the next page without removing the previous from the book) and scanning has a little bit of overlapping between the two sides: If it is a problem for you reviewing my work please tell me and I will either grab something else or use one side for sharable gestures and the other (after scanning of course) for warm ups (cubes mainly?).
I will probably grab the models less times (rn I always grab so I can put it next to my gesture) in order to speed up the exercise and use line of action's build in timer rather than my phone's.
I've also though about trying out some poses that are not from line of action itself.
2yr
Hey, @vesuvio! I appreciate your patience in getting my late reply - things have been a bit hectic for me lately, and only now I’m getting back to Proko, hopefully for a more steady run. :)
I think these gesture sketches look really good! The first one is probably my favorite in terms of smooth flow and exaggeration: I love the intensity of that S-curve on the spine and how it seems to flow down toward the leg. One thing you might wanna be aware of though is that the sketch misses the foreshortening of the pose. The way I see it, this is not a big deal for this context - you’re starting off, and foreshortening is a whole other level of complexity for your visual perception, so, for now, nothing to be corrected yet, just something to keep in mind and begin noticing gradually in future sketches.
I wonder what lead you to draw with white lines on a black background! No problem with that, just curious because dark lines on light canvases is what we see most commonly.
The sketches on other pages also show a nice sense of smooth flow, especially pages 5 and 6!
I see you wrote a question on your second page: “How do I show the whole weight ends up here?” Since that’s the only foot touching the ground, the viewer will intuitively understand that the body weight should be placed entirely there when they “read” your drawing - to make sure that sense of weight is believable, there are a few things you can try: give the foot and leg stronger line definition; use straighter lines, sharper angles and bolder strokes on the foot to visually describe muscular tension and support there; make sure the foot is placed coherently with the figure’s center of gravity so it looks balanced. Further lessons on the Figure course should help you with this idea of balance, but the other two are things you can try to start implementing right now. I’m attaching a draw-over of my own to illustrate how I’d solve it, hope it helps. Let me know if you have any questions about it.
About the Reilly method: Tim Gula gives a pleasing watching-worthy demo of how he applies it in the video posted below by @Crystal Blue (she/her), and it actually gets pretty close to what Stan explains in gesture lessons. There are some other resources out there about the Reilly method, such as this course by Mark Westermoe at New Masters Academy: https://www.nma.art/v3/course-catalog/courses/114916?lesson=30468 And my personal favorite: @Court Jones’s lesson from his caricature course: The Abstraction – Reilly Method for Caricature Drawing (although, of course, this one is focused just on the head).
Sadly, though, there don’t seem to be too many other materials with clear complete explanations on how the Reilly method works, or at least not to my knowledge. Most of the stuff we find about Reilly’s ways seems to have been passed on by his students and his students’ students, not by himself, so the information is not so neatly organized. The good news is that the overall logic behind the method is simply this: use flowing, rythmic lines to make the elements of a structure connect as a whole. In a figure, that can mean looking for long action lines from head to foot, visualizing continuity between the parts on different sides and trying to convey a feeling of “connectedness” across the whole body. Having this main idea of connecting rhythms in mind and using other concepts and techniques from the gesture lessons, with some practice, we should be able to sketch without necessarily getting attached to any schemes or pre-made formulas - although, of course, we can always refer to previously thought out methods such as Reilly’s, Loomis’s or any other as a way to stand on the shoulders of these giants there came before us.
Additionally, you might also like to get some familiarity with other sketching masters, such as @Glenn Vilppu, @Mike Mattesi and Michael Hampton.
Bonus comments: sure, definitely go ahead and use other poses, not just the ones from Line of Action! And, as a suggestion, you might like to use a collage, design or photo editing app to assemble various drawings into one single image - that way, you can post as many drawings as you want despite the website’s image attachment limit. In a computer, you could use good old Photoshop or any other software that allows you to import many images into one same file; and, on your phone, you could try Layout, PicCollage, Canva or any other similar app (there are tons of them!).
Hope you’ll find this feedback helpful.
Let me know in case any other doubts pop up.
Best regards!
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Here’s the Reilly method video: https://youtu.be/StRohW0Og3w
you seem to be grasping it pretty Wel though, keep up the good work!
2yr
Hello all!
I have read @Crystal Blue (she/her), @Liandro and @kemon replies and would really like to thank you all.
I tried limiting my time (30 seconds in regards for gesture while the bean was free from time limits) and will attach my work.
@Liandro hit the point in regards of using my whole arm (which is still a little difficult to do on my screenless tablet.) so I have also done some of the pictures on paper and experimenting with joints.
I am a really big fan of mechanical pencils so I used those instead of a traditional pencil (I am not sure but I think a mechanical pencil's mark is similar to only using the tip of a traditional pencil).
I am also thinking about looking for something that is able to stop my hand from getting stuck on the paper when its too warm or keep control when its too cold (I have noticed either either temperatures can be a little annoying, although its not really much).
Lastly, although you can see a little bit of "rust" in my drawings (I was only able to practice seldomly) I will now be able to practice way more often (ideally every day).
I will keep trying on both paper and tablet and will wait for your replies.
Thank you once again!
2yr
Glad I could help, @vesuvio! I’ll make more detailed comments on the other post above. Overall, nice work, keep going!
Nice work! The big lines you’re using make the poses flow very nicely.
what you can try doing now is pushing the poses even further. Think about the motion the figure is making and then intensify it. It’s helpful to think about what each part of the figure is doing (ex. Supporting weight, stretching, relaxing). I’d check out the videos on this site on the Reilly method if that doesn’t make sense, I’m also happy to answer any questions :)
I think timing yourself and limiting your time for gesture would be great for you: your drawings have a strong sense of form, but it feels like you could
be doing more to convey the motion. Limiting your time so that you are only able to capture the main movement in afew lines is a great excersize.
when you combine that with drawing from the shoulder like @Liandro discussed you can get some really nice movement
2yr
Hey, @vesuvio, this is cool! I really like the simplification and smooth flow of the gestures - great work!
I understand it can be really hard to keep control of rounded shapes while drawing from the wrist. Ideally, the best way is really to use shoulder movements to draw circles and longer lines, although I know this can feel kind of awkward with a non-display tablet.
As a major suggestion, I’d encourage you to give it a try anyway: experiment moving a bit more of your other joints (shoulder and elbow) as you draw, see how you can combine them with the wrist movements you’re already familiar with and notice what differences this brings to your work - then, feel free to keep whatever you think best fits your needs. It’s an exercise of trial, error and discovery.
As you do other types of arm movements with your tablet, make sure to consider proper adaptations for your circumstances so that it feels as comfortable as possible and your posture and physical health won’t suffer.
I would also have two different additional recommendations depending on the context:
. WHEN PRACTICING / STUDYING - For the sake of exercise, since your tablet might probably restrict your range of arm movements, I think it would be really helpful if you tried the Bean exercise on paper - that way, you’d be able to practice drawing the circles from your shoulder without restrictions, which should really help you with building up muscle memory to draw more flowing and confident curves in the long run. Preferably, try drawing on an easel or any other angled surface so that the paper won’t get distorted from your point of view. By the way, here’s the video where Stan shows the “drawing from the shoulder” technique, just in case you want a refresh: How to Hold and Control Your Pencil
. WHEN WORKING ON YOUR ART OR ON COMISSIONS - When you’re not focused on learning and simply want a clean result, you could use digital tools to help ease the aspect of your lines. Newer versions of softwares and apps such as Photoshop and Fresco already have built-in line smoothing functionalities. Alternatively, you could also try third party plug-ins such as Lazy Nezumi (for Windows) or HejStylus (for MacOS) - basically, their main purpose is to ease the motion of the cursor, which provides more stability to the lines as we draw, although the newer versions of these softwares also have several other utilities such as different types of rulers and grids. You might wanna do some research beforehand in case you’re interested.
About timing your drawings, I don’t see it as mandatory, especially because you’re being clear and concise in your sketches (one of the purposes of timed quick sketches is so we avoid getting lost in detail). But I also think timed gestures can be a very helpful exercise to practice intuitive flow, line economy and unattachment to result - so, if you’ve never done it, I’d encourage you to go ahead and try it. And, if you want, feel free to share your results and impressions with this community afterwards.
Hope this helps.
Keep up the good work!
2yr
Why don't you like your curves?
I think what you have looks like solid start. I have no suggestions other than keep practicing, You will build foundations from practicing these techniques that will provide you with a good base for you to explore more with your techniques that wouldn't have been possible for someone without this strong foundational understanding of gesture drawing. i think you're doing great. keep it up. And you're right, the next step probably would be setting time limits.
